Need advice about career and degree

[Carol Norton]

Originally Posted by Chris Saper

Matthew,

For what it's worth, here is my (with inflation) three cents worth. You've already got two years under your belt, stay where you are and get the university bachelor's degree. I believe you will never regret it, and that you may well regret abandoning it.

While you are in college, take other opportunities to do workshop study with artists who can really teach you - there are a lot of them out there. Once you get your bachelor's degree, there will be no fewer art opportunities open to you than there are now, including atelier study.

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Matthew, be smart and FINISH YOUR DEGREE! Two more years can go by quickly with a very worthwhile reward at the end - something no one can take away from you. Many careers don't care what your major was, only that you had the tenacity and intelligence to complete your degree. ALSO, Chris Saper didn't mention that she teaches a 5 day course at Scottsdale Artists' School called "For Love or Money: Portraiture." In that class she offers her students many practical methods of achieving beautiful portraits (lighting, color, getting a likeness, etc.) all interwoven with sound advice relating to the business of portraiture. It is one of the best courses that I have ever taken and taken and taken.... You could not enroll in a more valuable course. This year's workshop dates are Dec. 10-14. Save your money, birthday presents and latte $ and you'll soon find that you can afford this gem. I must warn you, her workshops fill quickly. To hold a spot in the 5 day classes, the school requires only a deposit until the month before the workshop starts, so that would give you time to earn the rest.

[Richard Bingham]

Richard M., Tom, very well said!

[Sharon Knettell]

I think Michele asked you some good questions.

What is a degree good for?
A: Teaching in a public university or college. You would need extra education credits to teach in K-12. You can teach at a private art school without one if your skills are what they need.
Teaching is more time consuming than you would think. For every hour you actually teach, you would have to put in another hour grading, doing course outlines and most tedious, syllabuses then there are those interminable faculty meetings.

The pay to start in most public colleges and universities is not great. RISD is pretty good as well as some of the other major colleges.

That is it as far as I can think.

B: Richard Bingham is right-don't waste your money on a degree in illustration it is a deader than dead duck as a career.

C: If you are interested in figurative work, do NOT go to RISD. I taught there I know. It is outrageously expensive and geared toward the abstract and theoretical artist. There is relatively little figure drawing after the first year. They have one long day of figurative work in the freshman year and the rest of the school years it is optional and relatively little is offered. There is a student group that organizes figurative work after hours but you have to pay for that. They feel the same way about figurative work as the school you are presently attending.

D: Art is a calling, not a business.You have to take a vow of poverty. Van Gogh only sold two paintings in his life; Molinard, a French Baroque court favorite, and total mediocrity became one of the wealthiest artists ever. Most of the the major forces in art history were interested in exploring concepts, color, paint manipulation, mediums etc. They were a curious lot. The were of course unhappy during the difficult years, some never overcame them.

E: It really depends on how talented you are. Talent is the single most important ingredient. It helps to have a keen intellect, courage and the ability to survive, perhaps, constant rejection.

You have to decide if you want a regular middle class American life and how important it is to you. The safest route is best here, but there is no quarantee of success that way either.

Personally I would rather spend my time and money studying with someone I respect and feel can learn from. I do not have a degree.

[Sharon Knettell]

It is, last I looked, it costs 1/2 of RISD and completely figurative. It is in a gorgrgeous part of Connecticut. PAFA is good too.

It is on of the few tradional school of art giving a degree. A degree from here and PAFA would hold more weight than "Nowhere U", in getting a decent teaching job.

Maybe take a year off and transfer.

http://lymeacademy.edu/

http://www.pafa.org/splashHtml.jsp

[Mischa Milosevic]

Mat, I think you received more advice here than you bargained for. There is much wisdom here and I hope you can benefit from it.

It has been my experience to see many a graduate student from all walks of life even art search for a good art academy. Mind you these individuals love art and art is their passion. What is your hearts passion? Is it art? Pursue your hearts passion life is short and zooms by so fast.

Sharon summed it up well you will do well to take heed. If you are thinking about the pension fund don't. What you personally set aside for your future is what will be your security nest. Why do you think there are so many agencies offering private health and pension.

When I was in the US and deciding which school to attend and get a degree Lyme was my choice. The NY schools were on the top of my list as well but I chose the Angel Academy. Today, you have many good schools in the US to chose from. In the corporate world the degree is important in art it is not.

Tough choice hmmm

[Sharon Knettell]

Originally Posted by Mischa Milosevic

Pursue your hearts passion life is short and zooms by so fast.

I spent two useless years at The Boston Museum School. I wasted my time and my parents money. I learned nothing. I was lucky if an instructor showed up. They were in the the full throws of the "do your own thing school of art".

Better you work those two years and save for a school that can really teach you something. You are so lucky to have so many options in the fields open to you. Take evening figure drawing classes.

Most of us who are older artists spent a long time trying to teach ourselves how to paint figuratively. It was a desert and many of us desperately haunted libraries to find anything we could about traditional painting techniques. There were no ateliers, workshops, nothing and except perhaps for PAFA, schools that taught traditional methods. You are very lucky to have these.

If you live near a "Whole Foods", that is a great place to work. They pay $9-10 per hour, if you work Saturdays, they will pay you time and a half for Sundays, plus you get 20% off on your groceries. Many Brown and RISD students work at the one near me. Waiting tables and bar tending in high end restaurants are great ways to make money.

Also, if you want a guarantee, that any of these paths will ensure success and security, I would not even think of going into the arts. It would be better to go into a more secure field like law, banking, accounting etc. and do it in your free time. It is always like working without a net.

A good friend of mine once said, "Art is not for sissies".

[Matthew Severson]

I

[Sharon Knettell]

[QUOTE=Matthew Severson]I

[Richard Bingham]

[QUOTE=Matthew Severson] . . . I make $18/hour, working 36 backbreaking hours on the weekend, trying to pay for a education I

[Sharon Knettell]

I don't have a degree. I never have been asked if I had one. My work was my degree. I am glad I did not waste anymore time in my school learning nothing of use to me to get a degree. The only person who regretted I did not get a degree was my mother.

A list of artists who did not have degrees: Sargent, Van Gogh, Manet, Monet, Gauguin, Kollwitz,Frieseke, Klimt, Cassat, Degas etc. In the later 209th Century - Basquiat.

A degree has only become important, the BFA's, The MFA's in the latter half of the 20th century. They have certified a lot of Junk.

These artists have degrees: http://www.maryboonegallery.com/arti...lins_info.html
http://www.maryboonegallery.com/arti...muth_info.html
http://www.maryboonegallery.com/arti.../mir_info.html

It is a crap shoot.

Take some time to consider this.