Need advice about career and degree

[Richard Monro]

I feel compelled to defy conventional wisdom. Assuming that you have talent and desire to be a successful artist, I would strongly recommend that you take as many business and marketing courses as you can (perhaps toward a bachelor of business administration degree). One may be a phenomenal artist, but if you can't market the product and conduct a proper business, art will just be a frustrating hobby. The vast majority of really good artists are miserable failures commercially because they do not have the necessary sales skills or a proper mentor to guide them.

To acquire the necessary art skills, take the one or two week courses offered by outstanding artists such as Daniel Greene, Norman Shanks, Marvin Mattelson and others. You will learn more from them in a week than you will from a years instruction in most "art colleges". it will also a lot less expensive plus you will be able to get good guidance from someone who has succeeded.

One last point. Less than 5% of the population are entrepreneurs, 80% need to be told what to do and the remainder are somewhere in between. An entrepreneur is self assured, very focused on what they want to achieve and comfortable in pressing forward when everyone is telling them that they will fail. if you don't fit this profile, it will be difficult to succeed as a professional artist. The one exception is the artist that has financial support from another source such as a mate. This enables the artist to proceed with less of a fear of failure and the urgency to bring in income to survive. Eventually this type of artist can also succeed if the talent is there.

Make a plan for your future, set realistic goals and then work the plan to achieve the gaols. Success will follow.

[Tom Edgerton]

Matthew--

My two cents:

Given that you want to do either medical illustration or teach, I'd finish the degree. Otherwise, if you want to be a fine artist without the special disciplines attached, leave and study more specifically in the academies, ateliers, and workshops, with those who teach what you want.

Medical illustration will require the ancillary stuff in the sciences. You may need to get a partial medical degree...some later grad work will definitely be in order (I investigated it at one time). Johns Hopkins and Medical College of Georgia used to have grad programs in it, but I don't know if they still do. Also, while you're there at the university, I'd take some business or entrepreneurship courses, and related technical courses like photography, media and IT. The advantage of a university is that there's a lot in one place, however watered down a given course might be.

If you expect to teach at the university level, you'll have to have the degrees. Community colleges are another story in some cases, but if they mirror our system, the pay is lousy.

Also, if something in you has to have a college degree to satisfy some psychological need or inner urge, that's a legitimate reason. But don't give this more attention or credence than it demands. For those who visit this forum who feel wistful that you never got a university art degree, don't spend a second looking back and pining. It speaks so little to what I do now, it was hardly worth it. In hindsight, I'd have taken another path if I knew I'd end up here.

While everyone might not agree on its value, though, you ARE halfway to the degree, and you don't have a clear picture yet of your future needs. When undecided, I often revert to "Better to have and not need, than need and not have." It'll be harder to double back and get it later.

Best of luck--TE

[Richard Bingham]

Richard M., Tom, very well said!

[Sharon Knettell]

I think Michele asked you some good questions.

What is a degree good for?
A: Teaching in a public university or college. You would need extra education credits to teach in K-12. You can teach at a private art school without one if your skills are what they need.
Teaching is more time consuming than you would think. For every hour you actually teach, you would have to put in another hour grading, doing course outlines and most tedious, syllabuses then there are those interminable faculty meetings.

The pay to start in most public colleges and universities is not great. RISD is pretty good as well as some of the other major colleges.

That is it as far as I can think.

B: Richard Bingham is right-don't waste your money on a degree in illustration it is a deader than dead duck as a career.

C: If you are interested in figurative work, do NOT go to RISD. I taught there I know. It is outrageously expensive and geared toward the abstract and theoretical artist. There is relatively little figure drawing after the first year. They have one long day of figurative work in the freshman year and the rest of the school years it is optional and relatively little is offered. There is a student group that organizes figurative work after hours but you have to pay for that. They feel the same way about figurative work as the school you are presently attending.

D: Art is a calling, not a business.You have to take a vow of poverty. Van Gogh only sold two paintings in his life; Molinard, a French Baroque court favorite, and total mediocrity became one of the wealthiest artists ever. Most of the the major forces in art history were interested in exploring concepts, color, paint manipulation, mediums etc. They were a curious lot. The were of course unhappy during the difficult years, some never overcame them.

E: It really depends on how talented you are. Talent is the single most important ingredient. It helps to have a keen intellect, courage and the ability to survive, perhaps, constant rejection.

You have to decide if you want a regular middle class American life and how important it is to you. The safest route is best here, but there is no quarantee of success that way either.

Personally I would rather spend my time and money studying with someone I respect and feel can learn from. I do not have a degree.

[Sharon Knettell]

It is, last I looked, it costs 1/2 of RISD and completely figurative. It is in a gorgrgeous part of Connecticut. PAFA is good too.

It is on of the few tradional school of art giving a degree. A degree from here and PAFA would hold more weight than "Nowhere U", in getting a decent teaching job.

Maybe take a year off and transfer.

http://lymeacademy.edu/

http://www.pafa.org/splashHtml.jsp

[Mischa Milosevic]

Mat, I think you received more advice here than you bargained for. There is much wisdom here and I hope you can benefit from it.

It has been my experience to see many a graduate student from all walks of life even art search for a good art academy. Mind you these individuals love art and art is their passion. What is your hearts passion? Is it art? Pursue your hearts passion life is short and zooms by so fast.

Sharon summed it up well you will do well to take heed. If you are thinking about the pension fund don't. What you personally set aside for your future is what will be your security nest. Why do you think there are so many agencies offering private health and pension.

When I was in the US and deciding which school to attend and get a degree Lyme was my choice. The NY schools were on the top of my list as well but I chose the Angel Academy. Today, you have many good schools in the US to chose from. In the corporate world the degree is important in art it is not.

Tough choice hmmm

[Sharon Knettell]

Originally Posted by Mischa Milosevic

Pursue your hearts passion life is short and zooms by so fast.

I spent two useless years at The Boston Museum School. I wasted my time and my parents money. I learned nothing. I was lucky if an instructor showed up. They were in the the full throws of the "do your own thing school of art".

Better you work those two years and save for a school that can really teach you something. You are so lucky to have so many options in the fields open to you. Take evening figure drawing classes.

Most of us who are older artists spent a long time trying to teach ourselves how to paint figuratively. It was a desert and many of us desperately haunted libraries to find anything we could about traditional painting techniques. There were no ateliers, workshops, nothing and except perhaps for PAFA, schools that taught traditional methods. You are very lucky to have these.

If you live near a "Whole Foods", that is a great place to work. They pay $9-10 per hour, if you work Saturdays, they will pay you time and a half for Sundays, plus you get 20% off on your groceries. Many Brown and RISD students work at the one near me. Waiting tables and bar tending in high end restaurants are great ways to make money.

Also, if you want a guarantee, that any of these paths will ensure success and security, I would not even think of going into the arts. It would be better to go into a more secure field like law, banking, accounting etc. and do it in your free time. It is always like working without a net.

A good friend of mine once said, "Art is not for sissies".