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09-24-2006, 11:07 PM
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#1
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PHOTOGRAPHY MODERATOR SOG Member '03 Finalist Taos SOPA '03 HonMen SoCal ASOPA '03 Finalist SoCal ASOPA '04 Finalist Taos SOPA
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,674
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike McCarty
Ant,
You have a much keener eye than I. I would say that the color, apart from the composition, is well within the window of believability.
There is a window, is there not? After all, reality changed for him every second, just as it does for us. Can anyone hope to achieve a perfect moment when that moment will not stand still? Even when It stands still in a photo, as artists we must be given some latitude of believability.
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Mike,
in my opinion the work is still a nice painting, but some parts resemble to a work from photo and since it was B&W at that time it seems to me he had to make up some colors. Maybe he had the real objects close, but the photo-reference dependence is clearly showing in the light-blue fabric of the little girl's dress. I also find the shadow of the face a bit too warm. Perhaps this digital reproduction is not making justice (?).
Ant
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Ant, et al,
First of all I don't have much faith in this reproduction. Sometimes you can get good ones and sometimes not. This one seems dark and I don't have my good edit program available to make it better. I could lighten it up some, but as far as making color adjustments that would seem to be totally arbitrary.
But apart from that -- Let's say that you are right on the money with your analysis. It seems like a very long way to stretch your rubber band, but let's say that your assertions could be proved 100% right. My questions are these:
First of all, who should care? Apart from a couple of portrait forum jockeys like you and I who deal in this sort of minutia, who should care?
Which leads me to this question: Given your proven facts, do you think less of this painting, or more? Or, given that what is seen is within an acceptable range of plausibility, would these facts have no bearing on the quality at all?
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Mike McCarty
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09-25-2006, 12:18 PM
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#2
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Juried Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Location: Ituiutaba-MG (interior of Brazil)
Posts: 63
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Quote:
First of all, who should care? Apart from a couple of portrait forum jockeys like you and I who deal in this sort of minutia, who should care?
Which leads me to this question: Given your proven facts, do you think less of this painting, or more? Or, given that what is seen is within an acceptable range of plausibility, would these facts have no bearing on the quality at all?
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Mike,
I hardly find a flawless painting, and never am quite satisfied with any of my own. Roubadi's work is a very good one. The small problem with the light-blue fabric that lies above her knees looks like a photo-reference issue the painter had. And it would only get worse if you lighten this reproduction, so I really believe it's there.
But yes, it is within a very acceptable range of plausibility, and what I think (even if shared with others) would in no way have any bearing on the quality, given that the observers can always have their own interpretation and in most cases they just go Wow! when they see a craftsmen work well done.
And by the way, I think I would never mention this to Roubadi if I lived at his time and could have had any contact with him. Simply because I think I could not have done any better.
Ant
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09-25-2006, 06:56 PM
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#3
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PHOTOGRAPHY MODERATOR SOG Member '03 Finalist Taos SOPA '03 HonMen SoCal ASOPA '03 Finalist SoCal ASOPA '04 Finalist Taos SOPA
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,674
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Here are some interesting compositions of past U. S. Presidents.
The first composition I'll admit is less than remarkable, but the story is worth telling. This portrait of Lyndon Johnson by Peter Hurd was meant to be Johnson's official White House likeness. But that plan was quickly scrapped after Johnson declared it "the ugliest thing I ever saw." Soon the pun was making the rounds in Washington that "artists should be seen around the White House--but not Hurd." How would you like to have that pun hanging around your neck?
When Hungarian-born English artist Philip de L
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Mike McCarty
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10-02-2006, 07:10 PM
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#4
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PHOTOGRAPHY MODERATOR SOG Member '03 Finalist Taos SOPA '03 HonMen SoCal ASOPA '03 Finalist SoCal ASOPA '04 Finalist Taos SOPA
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,674
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Hovsep Pushman 1877 - 1966
I've seen this man's paintings somewhere, but I can't remember where. What I can remember is that they were mesmerizing. What I remember most of all was the surface texture and how it glowed from within. In a past life my master bedroom was designed in all things oriental. If I were to win the lottery I would populate my bedroom walls with Mr. Pushman's paintings, particularly his still lifes. I might even take them down the hall to other rooms.
Hovsep Pushman, later a naturalized American citizen, was born in Armenia in 1877. At age 11, he held a scholarship at the Constantinople Academy of Art. By 17, he had gone to the United States and started teaching art in Chicago. He studied the culture of China, immersing himself in oriental art and perhaps philosophy. He then studied in Paris under Lefebvre, Robert-Fleury and Dechenaud. He exhibited his work at the Salon des Artistes Francais in Paris, winning a bronze medal in 1914 and a silver medal in 1921. He also was awarded the California Art Club
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Mike McCarty
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10-02-2006, 07:15 PM
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#5
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PHOTOGRAPHY MODERATOR SOG Member '03 Finalist Taos SOPA '03 HonMen SoCal ASOPA '03 Finalist SoCal ASOPA '04 Finalist Taos SOPA
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,674
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I think that if someone were contemplating being a portrait artist, that someone could do worse than begin by painting still life's. There is much similarity in the meticulous set up of a still life that informs the portrait artist.
Here are a couple of the still life's for which Hovsep Pushman is better known. Both oil on panel.
1- Austere Solitude 29x26
2- Serenade to a dream 28x23
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Mike McCarty
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10-02-2006, 07:44 PM
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#6
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!st Place MRAA 2006, Finalist PSOA Tri-State '06, 1st Place AAWS 2007
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Kernersville,NC
Posts: 391
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Right you are, Mike.
I can feel the depth and each object seems to occupy its space. Indeed these paintings illustrate all of the elements that a portrait artist tries to achieve.
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John Reidy
www.JohnReidy.US
Que sort-il de la bouche est plus important que ce qu'entre dans lui.
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10-02-2006, 10:46 PM
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#7
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PHOTOGRAPHY MODERATOR SOG Member '03 Finalist Taos SOPA '03 HonMen SoCal ASOPA '03 Finalist SoCal ASOPA '04 Finalist Taos SOPA
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,674
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John,
To me composition is made up of two main ingredients: the shapes of those things which are being portrayed, with their relationship to each other, and the light which falls upon them.
When these things are well considered some of the other very important aspects begin to fall into place, like values, edges and focus, which can all be a byproduct of good arrangement and good light.
These things are exemplified in the figures, and especially the still lifes above. Each of the figurines and objects is lit and shadowed in their own right. There is little difference in this set up and the set up for a portrait of a live person.
These exercises in "real space," I think are the backbone of a successful portrait. To often we try to piece things together after the fact, create the design as we go. When we proceed in this manner much of the essence of space, light, shadow and atmosphere are not carried forward, mostly because it was never there to begin with.
I would be very surprised if Mr. Pushman painted from anything less than the full set up that we see above, laid out with perfect lighting and all the atmosphere (real space) that now comes through. No matter how you proceed to paint, no matter your method, the set up that preceeds it is the same.
My Past Dreams 21x16 oil on panel
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Mike McCarty
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