Who to Study With?
 

I "met" with a local portrait artist this week, via a phone conversation about an hour long. I will be meeting him at his studio, with my portfolio this evening. Perhaps some of the professionals here could offer me some advice about how to choose someone to study with.

I have been searching for a talented and successful portrait artist to study with. Last year I met with Stanka Kordic, is a member of SOG who lives 45 min from me. It was pure inspiration to visit her studio and to see her beautiful paintings in person. And she is delightful, and very successful, and very busy. After the experience of being in a pro's studio, I knew I needed a professional who is looking to pass his/her knowledge to a willing student.

The gentlemen I will be meeting has a large portfolio of professional commissions with university presidents, CEOs, wealthy families through three generations. He has worked extensively as a portrait artist for American Greetings and his work hangs in several museums in this area. He holds a small class one evening a week in his studio and says he hopes to pass his knowledge on to aspiring portrait artists.

Can any of you offer suggestions of what to look for when meeting him tonight? I have NO knowledge of painting to speak of so I am an empty canvas, so to speak. At 49 yrs, I do not want to learn one way only to have to relearn to paint another way. The luxury of wasting time is not mine!!

Thank you,
Pat

Go for it!
 

Hi Pat,

My thought is "gosh, what are you waiting for?". This sounds like a fantastic opportunity to study with someone who, from your list above, must be quite an accomplished portrait artist. What kind of commitment does he require? Do you have to sign up and pay for a year of his classes? Six months?

When we lived in Holland I took lessons from an excellent portrait artist for a year, I signed up in advance. She also had painted dignitaries, Dutch royal family, etc. . . She was a great painter and pastel artist but when I look back on the experience I realize she wasn't that good of a teacher. Not to mention the fact that she spoke only Dutch and I didn't . . . you can imagine how little communication there was. But, am I sorry I spent all that money and time going to her workshop to paint twice a week for 3 hours? No. It was one of the best experiences of my life. I learned a lot by watching her, by practicing painting from life at each workshop, and by having her come by and grab my paint brush to show me what to correct.

So, I say, why not? My feeling is that you'll be able to bring a lot away from most learning experiences like this. Unless, and I didn't get this impression from your e-mail, you've got a handful of other artists that you're considering studying with and you're trying to make a decision about which one to pick, then I'm not much help on which questions to ask except to look at the style you like.

hope this helps,

Joan

Hi Joan,
Your experience with learning to paint in a language foreign to you made me laugh!! But your story is very encouraging. Thanks for sharing that.

To answer some of your questions, no, artists are not lining up to teach me!!! In fact I haven't been able to find anyone until now. He has a small class of ten students and teaches on Thursdays for three hours. But he has taken particular students under his tutelage,(over the years students have lived with he and his wife in a room off the studio!) He only requires that I pay for the first ten weeks up front and then it is pay as you go. He has some students who have been coming for years and he says it is like a small art community.

Here is why I am hesitating. He used to use live models but doesn't anymore. He strictly lets his students come in with photographs. That one issue is very worrisome. I understand that most artists take photos and do not paint from sittings but I don't know if that would be the best way for me to begin, from all that I read here. I was thinking about asking him if I could bring in a model as I have a niece and her friends who are willing to pose for a small fee. This is just a thought right now.

I'll definately know more after meeting him tonight!!

Live models
 

Hi Pat,

Maybe he would be open to you bringing a model and maybe some of the other students would want to split the fee for the model. Perhaps others would want to learn to paint from a live model too. That might be something to discuss with him. Of course, he might have some reason why he doesn't want a live model around??? Let me know how it goes tonight.

Either way though, you could still probably learn a whole lot from him. Does he mainly paint from photographs? I would ask him how he expects you to learn to the best of your ability without learning to paint from a live model. It would be interesting to hear what he has to say about that, especially since he is such a succussfull portrait artist.

You could also consider taking the classes from him AND spending a few hours a week painting your neice and her friends if that's something that might work for you.

Good luck, I'll be curious to hear how this turns out,

Joan

Just to let you know how last night went, meeting this portrait artist who takes students individually.

His paintings are beautiful, very realistic. His house is full of oils and pastels. However the newest painting hanging in the house is almost 15 years old. But it is a beautiful portrait which I immediately recognized as one I had seen at a show several years ago. It really stuck in my mind and I was so suprised to be standing in front of a piece I remembered falling in love with. He could have sold me then and there, but then his students started to arrive . . .

His studio is a family room-turn classroom with good easels and good lighting. About ten easels were set up and I was there until his students came, an interesting range of ages from gradeschool to middle age. A couple of them had some very nice pastel portraits going which were commissions. Some of the other students' work was pretty weak. One girl was drawing from a magazine pic of Julia Roberts - yuck!

He showed interest in my drawings and asked if I was getting commissions, what was I charging, etc. He told me what he felt I could charge. Well, this is not exactly what I care about right now. I want to grow as an artist more than I want to earn money (though I would never turn down a chance to make a buck here or there!!) He waxed on about how successful his students are at making a living off their art. I asked why he does not have a live model in his class anymore (he had told me he used to, years ago) and he said it was because everyone was interested in working on their own commissions with their reference photographs. He said he does not just teach you how to paint realistic portraits but he helps you start your own business.

I saw that several students had terrible reference photos - studio photography, magazine pics, flash photos! That's when I figured this was not the guy for me! :thumbsdow

I would rather save my $30/week until I have enough to take a class with Marvin!!

And so it goes . . .

...

Patricia,

Earlier I was going to say - If you see his paintings and say to yourself "gee I wish I could paint like that," then this guy might have something to teach you.

It may be that this fellow is doing all he can to make a living. This may mean that he take on the occasional dunderhead. It could be that in spite of all that you saw, you could extract good and useful things from this man.

At the risk of being self-serving, I think you should study with me.

The workshop I'm teaching this fall, "For Love or Money: Portraiture and the Pursuit of Excellence", addresses painting skills, business skills, and focuses on a combination of working from the live model, and photos. That means getting your own your photo resources under control.

There are advantages in studying locally with a strong teacher, and there are advantages to taking focused workshop study - which I don't think should be done more than twice a year. It takes a long time at the easel to decide what will work for you, and what won't.

You can download a brochure here: http://chrissaper.com/events.htm
I have one opening left in November.

Patricia - I think you did the right thing (just my 2-cents).

Chris - your workshop runs a month or so every Monday? So this is not something someone could go to who lives far away. This sounds like one I would be interested in, but it would have to be condensed into a week....keep me posted if something like that comes along.

Patricia, I think you made a good decision too. Who you study with ultimately depends on what your goals are. If you want to learn the technique of oil paintings and copy photos there are many people who would qualify as good teachers. If you want to learn to be a successful business person and self promoter you can also follow the lead of many.

If you want to learn how to interpret and recreate the illusion of three dimensionality on a flat surface you need to be taught to paint and draw from life. This is an all encompassing lifetime study which rewards those who succeed with incredible satisfaction each step along the way.

If you want to learn oil painting then go to someone who teaches that specifically.

You can certainly judge a teacher by the quality of the work of the students but seeing some students of lesser talent doesn't necessarily mean anything. More importantly you should judge the kind of progress that each of the students makes and continues to make even after they finish their study.

Because someone is a good artist doesn't mean they are necessarily a good teacher. In fact, this can sometimes be a liability. Many good artists create great paintings in spite of their approach based on intuition and natural talent. Those two things can't be taught. The best athletes don't usually make the best coaches. If you do find someone who is both you are in a very unique situation. Both teaching and the ability to perform are rare indeed.

Also be wary of teachers whose students' work lookvery much like their own. They are not teaching painting but merely technique. The test of a great teacher is that the students they teach develop as individuals and not clones.

Good luck.