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-   -   Learn to paint in the grand style! (http://portraitartistforum.com/showthread.php?t=261)

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:03 AM

Copy the Old Masters - it is a good way to learn!
 
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I learned to paint in that grand style by copying Old Master paintings.

When I was learning to paint, I spent two years doing nothing but copying old paintings I loved. I was not able to go to any museum to do this, I simply got the best print I could find of what I wanted to paint and worked from that in my studio.

There is a book that helped me at that time and it is "How to Paint Like the Old Masters" by Joseph Sheppard. You can find it on Amazon at:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/IS...rokeofgeniusA/
Although I find the paintings in this book somewhat vulgar, it was helpful in that it showed the stages of several different kinds of underpainting technique.

Here is my copy of Isabella Coymans after Frans Hals.

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:06 AM

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"Young Man" by Giovanni Boltraffio

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:10 AM

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My copy of "French Maiden" by Corot

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:31 AM

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My copy of "The Calmody Children" by Sir Thomas Lawrence

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:34 AM

An unfinished copy
 
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This is my copy of "The Waterbearer" by Ingres. It is unfinished and left as an underpainting.

See another underpainting and additional information at "Underpainting" http://forum.portraitartist.com/show...=&threadid=190

Michael Georges 12-05-2001 11:03 AM

Karin:

Wonderful work! I agree completely. It is simply amazing how much you can learn from copying a master work.

Here is my copy of William Bouguereau's 1877 painting "The Storybook":

http://www.fineportraitsinoil.com/Storybook-300.jpg

Michael Georges 12-05-2001 11:04 AM

And my copy of Hans Holbein's 1527 painting of "Sir Thomas More":

http://www.fineportraitsinoil.com/ThomasMore-300.jpg

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 07:31 PM

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This is my copy of M. Granet by Ingres.

Yoshiharu Himata 12-05-2001 08:48 PM

Karin, Michael,

I am very surprized at your work.
They are dignified and are very advanced.

The book, "How to Paint Like the Old Masters" by Joseph Sheppard, is available in Japan which translated to Japanese.
I bought the book, years ago.
Karin's comments are just correct, I agree.

I am interested in copy of old masters work, very much.
I want to challenge.
The original picture of high quality is available from web site, from ARC for example.
I like William Bouguereau very much.:)

Is there any points I had better to know, about copy, beforehand?
Please give me some advice.

Michael Georges 12-05-2001 09:24 PM

Yoshiharu:

Greetings, I have seen your work in the critiques forum - you are making great strides. :)

My best advice when copying a master work is to get the best reference available to you. In my case, I found paintings that had large museum posters available of them. I used these as my base reference and found other images of the same painting in books, on the Internet, etc.

For The Storybook, I visited the LACMA museum in L.A. and viewed the original through binoculars - it was about 9 feet up on a wall behind some furniture on display. I gridded the painting off on a sheet of paper and took fairly copious notes for each square noting color, visible brush strokes, etc.

And finally, if you choose to copy any work, then make your copy at least 5% off of the size of the original. Never paint the original artist's signature. Sign your own name and put "After" and the original artists name. I do this in paint on the front, and on the back in pencil.

Good Luck! :D

Karin Wells 12-05-2001 10:21 PM

Yoshiharu,

Basically I obtained as clear a print of a painting as I could find and began to copy it using the underpainting technique. And at first it was very difficult for me to do. I finally settled on an Old Master palette and this made all the difference. See: http://forum.portraitartist.com/show...=&threadid=210

Sometimes, after I did a copy, I was fortunate enough to be in a Museum somewhere and view the original. It was nearly always a rude shock. Although my paintings looked like the print I copied from, the prints seldom looked like the original painting! :)

Despite this drawback, I learned to paint anyway. I really can't think of any special prepartation...just pick up your brush and begin.

Yoshiharu Himata 12-05-2001 11:42 PM

Michael,

Thank you very much for your polite advice.
Slightly small, and a signature of a painter don't copy. OK? I understand it.

It is difficult for me to go to museum and see original. And I do not have high quality printed matter. Only website is a reliance. I intend to look for it at http://www.artrenewal.org/museum/b/B...iam/page1.html

I knew Bouguereau, last year. Till then, I did not know his name and his picture.

Yoshiharu

Yoshiharu Himata 12-06-2001 12:07 AM

Karin,

I should have said thanks for your valuable message, I forgot it. Several weeks ago.
I read your Old Masters Palette article. And I went to art supplies shop immediately. I supplemented the paint which lacked on my palette.
In particular cadmium orange is a very important color for me, now. Thank you very much, Karin.

I am helped by many friends here, in this forum.
This is very nice. I am happy.

Yoshiharu

Abdi R Malik 12-06-2001 03:50 PM

Hello, Karin, Michael, Yoshiharu

What a beautiful Paintings, wordless to give a critique they just perfect. Congratulations.

Frankly, It was the Old Masters whose had inspired me to paint for the very first time. Since no Masterpieces are available at the Museum in my country, the only references are from the book and internet, but lacks of details. I am trying to get a good print of it. I admire Ingres a lot for his realistic skin tones, dress, drapery.

Again, your Old Master copies are amazing.

Yoshiharu I saw your work and you are talented.

Regards
Abdi

Cynthia Daniel 12-06-2001 04:00 PM

I'm not sure of the quality and detail, but I know the Art Renewal Center is selling prints of the works they have there. You can ask, but the impression I have is that they are high quality.

Michael Georges 12-06-2001 04:50 PM

A wonderful site for reference:
 
The site reference below is the Web Gallery of Art. It has about 8000 high-definition scans of paintings from 1100 to 1800. It is a great site for getting fairly accurate reference for many, many old master works. Enjoy! :)

http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/artist.html

Karin Wells 12-06-2001 06:30 PM

I think that this is the most comprehensive image search tool on the web:
http://images.google.com

Cynthia Daniel 12-07-2001 08:38 AM

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Here's a place that appears to be in Russia that actually makes a business out of copying paintings. They show several step-by-steps and one is of Czar Nicholas by Ilya Repin, shown below. http://www.artsstudio.com

And Carol Jackson Presents has the original high quality art image site: http://sunsite.dk/cgfa/

Karin Wells 12-07-2001 09:24 AM

Thanks Cynthia, This is a wonderful website to review for anyone who wishes to paint a copy.

Karin Wells 04-10-2002 11:43 PM

http://glazing.fws1.com/examples.htm

This site shows Vermeer's underpainting and glazing techniques.

Roberts Howard 04-28-2002 12:02 PM

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I agree that making copies of some masters can be useful for growing in a direction consonant with being a contemporary portraitist (not people dressed in modern clothes painted in a hundred year-old style, or worse, people dressed in antique costume to justify an old style).

For me, the great transitional portraitist was Sir Thomas Lawrence. His times kept him to painting smoothly render flesh, but everything else was subject to his astonishing brushwork. In a way, he brightened Velazquez's approach into something that has remained valid for quite a time.

I had always admired his approach to a saucy and lively Elizabeth Farren...so coquettish and seductive. He transfixes the viewer with her sidelong gaze and the liquid paint handling hold all of the secrets to how to paint.

This is a large copy that I made (about 70" tall). The photo isn't as good as I'd like and the light is reflecting into one section, but it does demonstrate getting into his head and trying to learn from it. In the course of painting it, Elizabeth took on a presence for me and I have it on a wall in the studio. Every morning, when I go to the studio, there she is down at the other end, welcoming me. It's a nice way to start the day.

Roberts Howard 04-28-2002 12:03 PM

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Here are some details of the brushwork

Leopoldo Benavidez 04-28-2002 12:45 PM

Howard's quote:
Quote:

"it does demonstrate getting into his head and trying to learn from it"
Copying the masters is certainly a great learning tool, because we are confronted not soley with pastiche, but with a re-definition of the past in terms of the present in our own work. The importance lies here....L

Karin Wells 04-28-2002 01:02 PM

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This is one of my favorites and you have done a wonderful copy. I did a copy of the Calmody children and in doing so, I learned a lot from Lawrence.

However, I do disagree with your statement:
Quote:

...(not people dressed in modern clothes painted in a hundred year-old style, or worse, people dressed in antique costume to justify an old style).
How a person chooses to dress and the style that a painter chooses to work in, need not conform to some arbitrary standard of anyone's taste. Personally I would prefer to not paint a kid in a T-shirt, but I would certainly not judge it to be "wrong" or "bad" for any artist to do so.

Also, if an artist cannot paint in a style that you consider "old," this would sadly narrow the creative range of ways that any of us might feel drawn to explore or paint.

Quite frankly, I think that most artists do not paint in an "old style" because they lack the technical skills...it isn't someting commonly taught nowadays in art schools.


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